Hurst Rambler Scrambler Q & A

Will put questions and answers here .
Then can meld them into each category

Any one that can answer these questions ?? New Questions up top here :

Q: What Part number(s) is OEM factory original correct for my 1969 Sc/Rambler , as it came out of the factory in Kenosha .???
A:Hi Bob, The radiator in my original SC/Rambler and listed in the AMC 67 to 72 parts book, F-14072, is a Blackstone radiator part number 319 4331 for 1969 01 and 10 (V-8). In 1969 the model number 01 is V-8 Rambler Americans and model number 10 is V-8 Rebels. Regards, Jim

Q: TAIL LIGHTS How to restore and decipher the tail lights ?.
A : NOTE : Excerpt from a carburetor restorer ..
The most well-known carburetor material is olive-green colored zinc. Zinc itself is a bright silvery metal that reacts with air and water to make a powdery white material often called ‘white rust’ . To prevent this, carburetor parts are treated in the factory with a chromic acid solution, which forms a thin layer of ‘zinc chromate’ on the surface of the metal. This very effectively protects the metal underneath from being damaged by water or air. This is why carburetors are usually green!

I believe the coating to the entire tail light was zinc Chromate , and the refective material
is still unknown ...

Note 1 :From discussions with Mike Lewis and the scratch/sandpaper test . We have found that the tailights were never chromed , obviously pulled stock before the chrome process for the Sc/Rambler .

Note 2: A goldish thin coating either annodize or other process was used . Inside and out I found
this was everywhere . Inside the trunk view you can see black over spray and the gold coating.

Note 3 :Outside view was painted black . The housing was painted seperate from the car . I saw black paint under the tail light flange on the tail pan ...

Note 4 : It looks like an silver coating(Not Chrome) was applied to the inner housing for reflectivity. It does not flake like paint ??? . any clear info appreciated to solve this !
Photo's here
Trunk side view , note the over spray .
http://i84.photobucket.com/albums/k25/underdog57/ScRTaillight0002.jpg
http://i84.photobucket.com/albums/k25/underdog57/ScRTaillight0003.jpg
Inside reflector coating with the gold exposed under the silver .
http://i84.photobucket.com/albums/k25/underdog57/ScRTaillight0001.jpg
Silver color reflector coating
http://i84.photobucket.com/albums/k25/underdog57/ScRTaillight0004.jpg
http://i84.photobucket.com/albums/k25/underdog57/ScRTaillight0005.jpg

Q: GAS TANK , Will a 64 and on gas tank fit in the Sc?

Q: GAS TANK , The best tank restoration ?

Q:GAS LINE GROMMET, Does Gordy have the gas line gromet yet ?

Q:GAS LINE, Is the eng. compartment gas line the same as the amx ?

Q: GAS LINE , Do the reproduction gas lines have the ''spring'' protection ?

Q: GAS FILTER , Do we or should we install an extra gas filter?

Q: UNDERCOATING :
It sounds like most of the Scamblers were undercoated, at what point did the factory undercoat them? Was the drive train in the car? It appears that the Gas tank was. I guess what I need to find out is at what point do we put the factory undercoating on the car in order for it appear more technically correct.
A: Untill more info on this , It appears the gas tank was undercoated/sound deadener applied
before it went in the car.Mike Lewis)

BOB, THANKS FOR THE EMAIL. AMC CALLED THE UNDER BODY SPRAY SOUND DEADENING NOT UNDERCOATING, BUT WE ALL CALL IT AND LOOK AT IT AS UNDERCOATING. I WOULD THINK IT WAS PUT ON AT THE VERY END OF THE ASSEMBLY LINE OR VERY NEAR THE END FOR THE LINE FOR THE SIMPLE REASON IT WOULD TAKE A LOT OF TIME TO DRY BEFORE YOU COULD FINISH BUILDING THE CAR. ALSO I HAVE SEEN HUNDREDS OF AMC CARS NEW IN THE 60s AND UP. THERE WAS A LOT OF OVERSPRAY ON EVERYTHING UNDER THE CAR AS WELL AS THE OUTSIDE PAINT. THANKS AGAIN GORDY

Q: How do ID the 68/69 engine ?
A: You will see "390) Cast in near the motor mounts . 7/16" Head bolts . 70 and newer have 1/2" head bolts .
Engine(390) 68/69 Ports shape(This is stock to your Sc . 70 and newer have dog leg ports .Here is the rectangle port photo(s)http://i84.photobucket.com/albums/k25/underdog57/ScRParts0004.jpg
Close up
http://i84.photobucket.com/albums/k25/underdog57/ScRParts0005.jpg

Q: Fan Shroud , How can I tell if I have the right one ?

Photo's Differance from V8 and a Six cyl Steel Fan Shroud V8 on top , Six on bottom .
TheV8 has a larger outside diameter .
http://i84.photobucket.com/albums/k25/underdog57/ScRParts0001.jpg
V8 Fan shroud . Note the mounting flanges are equal .
http://i84.photobucket.com/albums/k25/underdog57/ScRParts0002.jpg
Six's Fan shroud . Note : Staggered Flange mounts
http://i84.photobucket.com/albums/k25/underdog57/ScRParts0003.jpg

Q:WHAT IS THE CORRECT PART NUMBER FORTHE SC/RAMBLER TURN SIG. SWITCH ? ANY AFTERMARKET NUMBERS OR CROSS REF. ?
A: The turn switch is GM. (DELCO). comment : more info? Thanks Bob

Q. Where can I get better SC/RAMBLER information ?

A: Go back in time , to around Febuary 1969 . Hang around with line workers and Hurst people .
Talk to Dave Landrith , H L Shahan . Hang out at the the third floor of the Kenosha building .
Watch hurst's crew put the special parts on the cars . Be around the parking lot as the cars are awaiting delivery . Hop on the trains and car haulers . 1512 cars were factory original then .

Other than that , this blog and contributers of real info has no peer . Or I would be reading
the alternate "best " site . Other than that go to car shows , compare cars . Look for one owner
original cars . Talk to Mike Lewis , Gordy Chilson , Joe Roberts , Jim McKee , Bill Strobel , Andre
Jacobs . Eddie Stakes . Pour over any and every "small" home spun site's , web pages .
Phone owners that have low miles cars , rare cars . Contact Linda Vaughn . Heck contact James Garner .
A guy named Joe , Fred , owners of restoration shops ..al this and more to be continued on this blog !!! hope thats worth you nickel !!
Bob

Q. IS THE SC/RAMBLER THE ONLY 60s MUSCLE CAR THAT HAD SEAT BELTS FOR SIX PASSENGERS ?

Q. How does the SC/RAMBLER rate concering a rear end collision ? Should be some information for the years 66-69. May have some information about the mid.68 gas cap and gas tank vent change.

Q. Do you have any information about the reproduction headliners?


Q: I have noticed that the smog pump vents out the side until the engine is warm. Is this the normal?
A : According to the AMC Factory Service manual the pump can relieve pressure out the back.
It should not vent out of the pressure relief valve at idle. For much more info , please refer to the Service manual ...

Q: Does the A.I.R. on the hood of the Sc/Rambler have anything to do with James Garners Race team ?? Which was A.I.R . "American International Racing" ???

Q :Little thing for the minutia freaks : What are the holes (interior) in the SC/RAMBLER doors for ?What years and models were these doors used on ? Answer this and to the Minutia area it goes !!
A : ???

Q: SC/RAMBLER HEATER VALVE : IS RESTORATION POSSIBLE ? I have seen an aftermarket valve that is still available and a bracket that is available but not combined.

Q: SC/RAMBLER HEATER VALVE : DID THE ORIGINAL HEATER VALVES HAVE NUMBERS STAMPED ON THEM ?

Q: SC/RAMBLER BATTERY TRAY : IS THE TRAY BLACK OR WHITE ?
A: White , Photo here
http://i84.photobucket.com/albums/k25/underdog57/Gordys0006.jpg

Anonymous said...
Q: SC/RAMBLER : FIFTEEN SC/RAMBLERS WERE SENT TO H.L. SHAHAN. WHAT WAS THE TOTAL USED AT THE 1969 ORANGE COUNTY RACEWAY (PRESS) EVENT ?
A: The way I understood from talking to Dave Landrith(President ofHurst Ind. Detroit)
15 promo cars were at the Orange County Event .
They shipped to H L to be stored for the event . I believe all the engines were stock with no
H L Shannon mods ...you can read more about H L , and Shirley Shannon in the Historic person and event section on the Blog. Be sure to look at The Dave Landrith Post .
I put it On the first Post , will migrate it to Historic persons and events ...

Update from conversation with H.L Shahan NOTE: Update :
H.L remembers seven Sc/Ramblers delivered to him . He had the heads removed for valve
jobs . just to get them better than factory . NO porting . The clutches were swapped out for better than stock .
H.L states Dave might of been thinking of 15 Rebel "The Machine"'s that he had for 1970. But is sure he had SEVEN Sc/ramblers !!

Q:Battery Terminal Location , Are the repro batteries Correct ?
SC/RAMBLER BATTERY : THE POSITIVE POST IS LOCATED ON THE LOWER RIGHT HAND CORNER. This detail can be seen in the SC/RAMBLER issue of CAR CRAFT (1969). THE NEGATIVE POST SEEMS TO BE LOCATED ON THE UPPER LEFT HAD CORNER.
http://i84.photobucket.com/albums/k25/underdog57/BobsscramblerPhotos0297.jpg
Question 2 Bat Term Locate:Do you mean Pos.post is on the left rear ,and neg post on the right front? as viewed from the drivers seat ? And is this the stock battery ?
Would like to follow up with pictures from the parts list or service manual ...as the first 30 cars were demo models ..??? Feed back , thoughts on this ????????
Repro Battery photo
http://i84.photobucket.com/albums/k25/underdog57/Gordys0006.jpg



Q. SOME OF THE SC/RAMBLERS HAD AIR SHOCKS ON THE REAR ?
A. I THINK THIS IS ANOTHER (NON FACTORY) DEALER OPTION. It seems like the rear leaf springs have some limitations and air shocks may have been a dealer quick fix or suggestion.
Comment: Have seen only one part number , so doubtfull the air shocks were from Kenosha ..

Q. Where does the rear carpet pad go ?

Q. How much extra time was allowed to make the Rogue an Sc/rambler ?.
I heard three hours ?

Q, were the Sc/Rambler made in small batches or did they get built all at once ??
A: Incomplete Data , We know the first 30 were taken as Promo cars . Papers show 500 were to be built . But business wise , our thoughts are that they cranked them all out as one batch.
We're working at getting this resolved one and for all .

Q. How were the Sc/r's distributed ?? . Kenosha to train . And ?

Q. WHY DOES MY SC/RAMBLER POP OUT OF 2ND GEAR ? Seems like it happens most when I do a quick deceleration or slow down. Thanks, Shorty
A . The seat is in the photo is all the way forward and the shifter is in the neutral and I can not
get it into 2nd gear.
http://i84.photobucket.com/albums/k25/underdog57/mLewisshifterseat.jpg

Popping out of gear article by Jim McKee (Extreme detail)
These are the items that cause an AMC T-10 in SC/Ramblers to not remain in gear besides the shifter handle hitting the seat in second and fourth. The seat interference problem is easily corrected by bending the shift handle at the bend about an inch at the T-handle. I know most SC/Rambler owners don’t want to bend and re-chrome their shift handles, so check these other items first;
Shifter adjustment. If the synchro sleeve is not moved completely into mesh with the synchro teeth on the gear it will often pop out. Readjust the shifter using a 1/4" drill or dowel pushed in the hole that runs through the shifter body and levers. Replacing the original nylon lever bushings with Hurst steel bushings tightens up the shifter.
A bent shifter fork can prevent the sleeve from fully engaging the teeth on the gear. The result is similar to an out of adjustment shifter. Replace the bent shifter fork. Please note; 1st and 2nd fork is the same as the 3rd and 4th fork.
The levers that bolt to the side of the transmission are loose and the effect is the same as bad shifter adjustment or bent fork. Tighten the levers. Usually requires readjusting the shifter.
The "C" shaped springs inside the synchro assembly that press on the three rectangular slider retention pieces inside the synchro sleeve are weak and this allows the sleeve to contact the teeth on the gear before the two are turning the same speed preventing them from fully engaging. Replace the entire synchro sleeve assembly. Individual parts are not available for synchro assemblies other than the brass synchro rings. The brass rings are available from Mr. Gasket in a four pack for Chevrolet T-10s. AMC T-10 small parts kits, shifter forks, front and rear seals, main shaft bearings, yoke bushings, bearings, first and reverse gear, and gasket kits are still available. Notice I did not include input shafts, reverse idler, third, or second gear, or the counter shaft. Many parts books list the same bearing for the input and mainshaft. The correct input shaft bearing has bearing shields and these metal rings cover the balls and prevent oil from flooding the front seal and leaking. The rear mainshaft bearing should not have these shields.
If the teeth on the gear or inside the synchro sleeve are worn and rounded off, they will be forced out of engagement (pop out of gear). They should look like a house with the roof peak pointing toward the synchro sleeve. If they are rounded off or broken the trans will not stay in gear. The teeth inside the sleeve need to be pointed the same shape as those on the gear but facing the gear. Please refer to the available parts listing in the previous paragraph. Speed shifting your SC/Rambler with the accelerator on the floor is not a good idea, because of the AMC T-10s limited gear availability.

The clutch is not properly releasing the disc. Readjust the clutch free play. If the free play adjustment is used up or makes no difference the clutch is probably worn out. The clutch can be rusted to the input shaft and this holds the disc in contact with the flywheel or pressure plate. Either of these items can prevent the synchro sleeve from fully engaging the gear increasing the likelyhood of coming out of gear. Replace the clutch. I suggest using a Hays street/strip diaphragm unit for Chevrolets 10 1/2" diameter disc with 1 1/8"x 10 spline #40-111, the pressure plate #33-610. For this clutch to work properly, the throw out bearing collar needs to be shortened by .200" where the throw out bearing presses on and the bell crank to fork lever must be lengthened to allow correct adjustment range. The big benefit with this clutch is it releases the disc much faster than the original Borg and beck clutch with rpm assist rollers and the transmission shifts are greatly improved. This clutch is rated for 500 horsepower and 7000 rpm.
The transmission is not in line with the crankshaft. This usually affects 4th gear only.
If the roller bearings inside 4th gear that ride on the mainshaft in front of 3rd gear synchro assembly are worn this can promote the trans coming out of 4th or 3rd gear. If the ball bearing on the mainshaft is galled the vibration can allow the trans to come out of gear. Usually 1st or 2nd. If the needle bearings in the countershaft are galled at the rear of the shaft this usually affects either 1st or 2nd or both. If the needle bearings are galled at the front of the shaft this usually affects 3rd or 4th or both.

Q: How do you get the hood Emblem Off without ruining it ?
http://i84.photobucket.com/albums/k25/underdog57/SCVSRoguetrunklid0006.jpg

Q. A LOT OF THE ORIGINAL SC/RAMBLER PARTS WERE DATED ?THE CARB., SPARK PLUG WIRES, TRANSMISSION, HOSE CLAMPS, TRUNK LID, SUN TACH, AND ????

A: Seat belts are date coded

A. Trunk lid date code:
http://i84.photobucket.com/albums/k25/underdog57/SCVSRoguetrunklid0001.jpg
Will do a wider view so you can locate it easier .
Heard the Hood ?? (will look) , Pass side valve cover "Tag" Should have a W in the number .Not aware of the rest of the numbers yet ...
Did not know the 635 tach was dated ? Its so hard to find ... and in the cup not visable .
Will ask around to see what we come up with , betting quite a few parts are dated . Rear end?
Glass LOF ?? Vin number of cource ...

Did this steering Wheel Center get shipped to a customer ?Or is this from a Prototype sc/rambler ??Explain this ?
http://i84.photobucket.com/albums/k25/underdog57/BobsscramblerPhotos0296.jpg